Brigham Young, who adopted the policies that now haunt the church. He described black people as cursed with dark skin as punishment for Cain’s murder of his brother. “Any man having one drop of the seed of Cane in him cannot hold the priesthood,” he declared in 1852. Young deemed black-white intermarriage so sinful that he suggested that a man could atone for it only by having “his head cut off” and spilling “his blood upon the ground.” Other Mormon leaders convinced themselves that the pre-existent spirits of black people had sinned in heaven by supporting Lucifer in his rebellion against God.

Think I missed something in the point of this post, explain what your point was please Candy ?

You say you prefer the Morman's instead of the Muslims.

I was pointing out one of their policies.

We do have a Muslim Leader on the Stoke-on-Trent Council, he is not a Radical.

Oh ok you jumped threads so wasn't sure. I do think since 1852 we have come along some. Interracial marriage is sadly common now and the ancient way of thinking has long passed. We are a Christian nation at least for now but one brought up under the Muslim faith will collide with modern views. I know many Mormons and they are fine God fearing people. Don't know much about Allah and not really interested. I am not religious, guess I am an agnostic, I will believe in what can be shown and proven to me .

Books tie pioneers' massacre to Mormon prophet / Church blames rogue official in 1857 incident
Emily Eakin, New York Times

On Sept. 11, 1857, a group of California-bound pioneers camping in southern Utah were slain by a Mormon militia and its Indian allies. The massacre lasted less than five minutes, but when it was over, 120 men, women and children had been clubbed, stabbed or shot at point-blank range. Their corpses, stripped of clothes and jewelry, were left to be picked apart by wolves and buzzards.

It was one of the worst American civilian atrocities of the 19th century. "The whole United States rang with its horrors," Mark Twain recalled years later. But despite two trials, one execution and numerous official investigations, the incident -- known as the Mountain Meadows massacre -- remains shrouded in mystery and rumor.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints -- the Mormon church -- has steadfastly denied responsibility, first blaming Indians and later a rogue church official for the crime. But now two authors who have studied the massacre say the prophet Brigham Young, the formidable church leader who built a Mormon kingdom in an oasis in the arid wilderness of the Rocky Mountains, masterminded the killings and then conspired to cover up his role.

"He did it," said Will Bagley, a history columnist for the Salt Lake Tribune whose book "Blood of the Prophets: Brigham Young and the Massacre at Mountain Meadows" (University of Oklahoma Press), has been a best seller in Utah since it appeared in late July. "The evidence is unambiguous."

Sally Denton, an investigative reporter based in Santa Fe, N.M., whose book "American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows," will be published by Knopf next summer, also holds Young responsible for the crime. "He was an absolute dictator," she said. "Nothing happened in the place that did not happen under his direct orders."

That conclusion is vigorously disputed by three Mormon church historians, who vow their own history of the massacre, to be published by Oxford University Press in 2004, will exonerate Young. "It's clear to us that this was not a headquarters-orchestrated project," said Glen Leonard, director of the Mormon Church's Museum of Church History and Art in Salt Lake City and one of that book's co-authors. "It was locally planned and carried out."

DOUBLE CROSSED
The current round of debate may be the bluntest yet about the episode, which, in addition to investigative accounts, has inspired at least five novels in the last several years. The massacre stands out not only for its gruesomeness but also for the act of treachery that preceded it.

After enduring a four-day gun battle with their attackers, the pioneers accepted a truce that turned out to be a deadly ploy. Promised safe passage from the area in exchange for surrendering their weapons, the besieged group complied only to be systematically slaughtered. Seventeen children, all under 7 years old, were spared. Taken in by local families -- including those of men who had participated in the attack -- the children were eventually returned to relatives, some later providing devastating testimony about the massacre.

Federal investigators suspected Brigham Young of having had a hand in the crime but failed to produce sufficient evidence to convict him. In an 1858 report to the federal Indian commissioner, Young blamed local Indians and, by implication, the U.S. government, whose "fatal policy," he wrote, "treats the Indians like the wolves, or other ferocious beasts."

Then, in 1870, Young excommunicated John D. Lee, a Mormon official and militia leader in southern Utah, because of his participation in the massacre. Lee was tried twice for murder (he was convicted the second time) and executed in 1877. But rumors of a church-sponsored cover-up persisted. Many Mormons -- particularly in southern Utah -- left the church over the incident.

Well I am sure the Mormons of today are much different.

I agree

They have changed their ideas.

But past History not good.

I agree but things have evolved over the last 100 years. Do me a favor when you post an article put a link to it also. Thanks

books tie pioneers' massacre to Mormon prophet / Church blames rogue official in 1857 incident


Emily Eakin, New York Times

I could not do a proper link to the above...came in on an email. but I do if I can.



A Buddy says Obama is going to be impeached.
Difficult to sift truth from fiction.

Require collection of unpaid taxes by federal employees -- $1 billion total savings

Our Politicians do the same and a few make false claims for expenses.

We need people with integrity.




A List of Republican Budget Cuts
Notice S.S. and the military are NOT on this list.
These are all the programs that the new Republican House has proposed cutting. Read to the end.

* Corporation for Public Broadcasting Subsidy -- $445 million annual savings.
* Save America 's Treasures Program -- $25 million annual savings.
* International Fund for Ireland -- $17 million annual savings.
* Legal Services Corporation -- $420 million annual savings.
* National Endowment for the Arts -- $167.5 million annual savings.
* National Endowment for the Humanities -- $167.5 million annual savings.
* Hope VI Program -- $250 million annual savings.
* Amtrak Subsidies -- $1.565 billion annual savings.
* Eliminate duplicating education programs -- H.R. 2274 (in last Congress), authored by Rep. McKeon, eliminates 68 at a savings of $1.3 billion annually.
* U.S. Trade Development Agency -- $55 million annual savings.
* Woodrow Wilson Center Subsidy -- $20 million annual savings.
* Cut in half funding for congressional printing and binding -- $47 million annual savings.
* John C. Stennis Center Subsidy -- $430,000 annual savings.
* Community Development Fund -- $4.5 billion annual savings.
* Heritage Area Grants and Statutory Aid -- $24 million annual savings.
* Cut Federal Travel Budget in Half -- $7.5 billion annual savings
* Trim Federal Vehicle Budget by 20% -- $600 million annual savings.
* Essential Air Service -- $150 million annual savings.
* Technology Innovation Program -- $70 million annual savings.
* Manufacturing Extension Partnership (MEP) Program -- $125 million annual savings..
* Department of Energy Grants to States for Weatherization -- $530 million annual savings.
* Beach Replenishment -- $95 million annual savings.
* New Starts Transit -- $2 billion annual savings.
� Exchange Programs for Alaska Natives, Native Hawaiians, and Their Historical Trading Partners in Massachusetts -- $9 million annual savings
* Intercity and High Speed Rail Grants -- $2.5 billion annual savings.
* Title X Family Planning -- $318 million annual savings.
* Appalachian Regional Commission -- $76 million annual savings.
* Economic Development Administration -- $293 million annual savings.
* Programs under the National and Community Services Act -- $1.15 billion annual savings.
* Applied Research at Department of Energy -- $1.27 billion annual savings.
* Freedom CAR and Fuel Partnership -- $200 million annual savings..
* Energy Star Program -- $52 million annual savings.
*Economic Assistance to Egypt -- $250 million annually.
* U.S.Agency for International Development -- $1.39 billion annual savings.
* General Assistance to District of Columbia -- $210 million annual savings.
* Subsidy for Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority -- $150 million annual savings.
*Presidential Campaign Fund -- $775 million savings over ten years.
* No funding for federal office space acquisition -- $864 million annual savings.
* End prohibitions on competitive sourcing of government services.
* Repeal the Davis-Bacon Act -- More than $1 billion annually.
* IRS Direct Deposit: Require the IRS to deposit fees for some services it offers (such as processing payment plans for taxpayers) to the Treasury, instead of allowing it to remain as part of its budget -- $1.8 billion savings over ten years.
*Require collection of unpaid taxes by federal employees -- $1 billion total savings.WHAT THE HELL IS THISABOUT?
* Prohibit taxpayer funded union activities by federal employees -- $1.2 billion savings over ten years.
* Sell excess federal properties the government does not make use of -- $15 billion total savings.
*Eliminate death gratuity for Members of Congress.WHAT???
* Eliminate Mohair Subsidies -- $1 million annual savings.
*Eliminate taxpayer subsidies to the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change -- $12.5 million annual savings WELL ISN'T THAT SPECIAL
* Eliminate Market Access Program -- $200 million annual savings.
* USDA Sugar Program -- $14 million annual savings.
* Subsidy to Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) -- $93 million annual savings.
* Eliminate the National Organic Certification Cost-Share Program -- $56.2 million annual savings.
*Eliminate fund for Obamacare administrative costs-- $900 million savings.
* Ready to Learn TV Program -- $27 million savings..
* HUD Ph.D. Program.
* Deficit Reduction Check-Off Act.
*TOTAL SAVINGS: $2.5 Trillion over Ten Years

Came in on an email...so do not know if fact or fiction.

Smells like a very liberal person sending you e-mails. Candy I am not saying this is from Gypsy but if you receive communication in forms such as this from her , do not post them here.

Guess What!

Since Gypsie's leaving I have not spoken to her or had any communication.

Except for the link she sent you, which was very wrong.
I did not answer.

I knew you would think I was in Collaboration with her.
So I have kept my distance.

Not even playing a game with her on IYT

Do you think I am a Moron...(Idiot)

No not a liberal person ....I think Republican...

My email info comes from more than one source.

I found the Video on fake Birth Certificate myself.

I did not ever receive anything from Gypsy but I now have her blocked on IYT and she as you know is banned here.
The list of cuts has alot of merit to it, some things I don't agree with but for the most it needs to be done to get this country back on the road to becoming debt responsible. 16+ trillion is not acceptable and right now we are free falling . I see no new ideas from our president accept spend-spend and let China foot the bill.